FSJ-List-Digest-44

Monday, December 9, 1996 3:33:28 PM

Table of Contents:





Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 06:46:22 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: the great jeep heist...& the war trials...

doogie,

I think we should also hold "war crimes" trials...  anybody that
would run a forklift into an old jeepster body should be tried
and executed....


what a travesty....  

we should have a day of mourning...

john

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 07:54:26 -0700
From: trust-at-lanl.gov (Terry Rust)
Subject: tyre size +

FWIW, ran 12.5x33 BFGs on my 83 WT with a rancho 3" lift, no rubbing or
other troubles, I now have 35" Mud Kings on my J10 with a 4" rough country
(aptly named!!) lift, the rears used to rub with a !/2 yard of crushed rock
in the bed, I added some overload coils, (cheap lift) which basically
compress into solid blocks, to keep the tires out of the flares. I know a
fellow running 32s on a wagoneer with what looks to be a 4" kit, no missing
chunks from the tires or crumpled bodywork so impact must be minimal.

Mark, are you coming home for the holiday? Fixing the wagoneer? Capitol
Scrap metal in SF has a couple of Wagoneers, one I ransaked looked really
nice, Had I the $$, the Jtruck would have power leather seats. Interested
in a J10?

I forgot what else I was going to talk about, it's only monday? what? ....

Terry  Rust

Pure guesswork has become the basis of a forecast that has been published
in newspapers to be read and understood as a scientific statement."
Endangered Species Blueprint, National Wilderness Institute

"I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important
part in balancing
ecosystems."
John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal







[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 08:30:17 -0700
From: dmatheny-at-mutoh.com
Subject: RE: Re: Voltage Regulator


>On 9 Dec 1996, Edwin Pedersen wrote:
>
>> Ol' White's voltage regulator is & has been TU for some time.
>> The voltage regulator is built-in to the temp gauge, incorporated
>> as part of the board. Rather than buying a new gauge and fighting
>> to install it, would it be feasible to just buy a new alternator with
>> a built in regulator in it, therefore bypass the defunct unit in the
>> temp gauge?
>>
>> Insert answers here ...................
>
>yes, extremely...this is a pretty common retrofit...more or less a bolt
>in.
>>
>> Ed Pedersen  Vancouver B.C.  Canada
>> '79 Cherokee Wide Track  QT  AT  I6
>> Dana 44's  3.54 gears
>>
>Later
>
>Mark

I'm a little confused now.  I thought the voltage regulator in the temp   
gauge provided 5(?) V to the instrument cluster and the voltage regulator   
in the alternator would provide 14-15V to run the vehicle and charge the   
battery.

Are there alternators that also provide regulated 5V?

My gauges do odd things occasionally when the engine temp changes quickly   
so I have been wondering if/how I could put  a real voltage regulator   
(digital) in to replace the mechanical one in the temp gauge.  Anyone   
know if/how this can be done?

[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 08:39:07 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: Q-Trac steering knuckle


On Dec 8, 10:38pm, Jim Sterling wrote:
> Subject: Re: Q-Trac steering knuckle
> 
> At 03:09 AM 12/8/96 EST, you wrote:
> >
> I bought a 79 with a qtrac unit in it about a year ago. I am in the 
process
> of putting the 79 body on the 83 frame. The 83 has a 360, 727 at, 208, 
dana
> 44 front (which I want to convert to 8 lug..anyone know what I need to 
do?),
> and AMC 20 rear. I can take the lever and whatever parts I have and 
send
> them to you. I might ever still have the Qtrac unit. I'll have to 
check. I
> sold the front and rear axles to a CJ owner. Just let me know...
> 
> jim sterling
> 79/83 Cherokee (real jeep)
> 91 cherokee limited (wife's car)
> 84 CJ-7 (wife's toy)
> 92 GMC Sub 4x4.. my "work truck".. all computer techs need a work 
truck
> don't they???
> jsterling-at-businessbasic.com
> 
>  
> 
>-- End of excerpt from Jim Sterling


I appreciate the offer...I'm not sure if I'm going to install a low 
range unit since I don't plan on doing much (if any) off-roading.  I'll 
get in touch if I become interested, but right now I don't know if the 
budget has room.  Need too many other things, like brakes...


Jeff Gunn
'78 Cherokee


-- 

Jeff Gunn
Design Engineer, Product Development
Shaffer, A Varco Company
V 713 937-5740
F 713 937-5779

[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 08:52:42 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: Pinto for an FSJ sir?


On Dec 8, 11:45pm, john wrote:
> Subject: Re: Pinto for an FSJ sir?
> 
> a Pinto for a Wagoneer, you betcha...   Anybody got a spare Pinto?  I
> could use another project...
> 
> Wait, cash works too...  let's see, I bought the 65 J200 for $250, the
> 69 for $100, and the 77 for $200.  Oh yeah, and Old Blue for $1,000...
> I did drive the 65 home...  the 69 could have been fixed for about 
$12,
> the 77 had a hole where the motor was...  Old Blue drove home but sat
> stalled in the drive for three months... oh yeah, and I found all of 
these
> rigs in the Little Nickel or the Buy and Sell...   This is FSJ 
heaven...
> Oh yeah, 2 out of 5 did NOT have floorboards...  or should I say 3 out 
of
> 5 came with floorboards...  brakes optional...  but that's another 
story...
> 
> john
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
------
>-- End of excerpt from john

Not bad wheeling and dealing, but I got my FSJ for FREE!  (I just had to 
brag.)
Before everyone asks, a guy I work with had a friend who was trying to 
get rid of a '78 Cherokee which had been sitting under a tree for about 
3 years.  My coworker already had a CJ-7, a pickup, and a station wagon, 
so he passed.  I had been complaining at work that I needed a project 
truck but didn't want to pay what people were asking (trucks are 
expensive in these parts!).  So he took me out to see the Jeep, and we 
got it towed to the house on a flatbed by AAA for free.  I never even 
met the benefactor!  The FSJ needed all the fluids changed, new plugs, 
and new filters.  I cranked her and she wouldn't run any longer than the 
starting fluid was sprayed into the carb.  Pulled off the fuel line, 
bone dry.  Chased it down and the guy had bypassed the fuel pump.  New 
fuel pump and I had a running Jeep.  Axle bearings and rear wheel 
cylinders and she passed state inspection.
All told, I've got around $500 in her, which isn't bad considering most 
of it is maintenance that I would have done to any used car I bought.  
The expensive part is all the things I WANT to do in the future!

Jeff Gunn
'78 Cherokee
"I left my floorboards under the old shade tree."

[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 09:01:34 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: what's flat???


On Dec 8, 11:53pm, john wrote:
> Subject: Re: what's flat???
> 
> At 11:34 PM 12/7/96 -0500, Joe Sego wrote:
> >At 10:43 AM 12/4/96 -0800, you wrote:
> >> make sure your wheels are blocked... watch yourself when you 
release the
> front driveshaft, the jeep might roll or move a little... 
> >Doesn't sound like advice for us flat-landers does it? :-)
> 
> what's flat-land????
> 
> john
> 
> 
>-- End of excerpt from john


What's snow (reference earlier discussions, different thread).

Jeff Gunn
Houston, Texas
Flat-land USA

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 07:51:56 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Last year of the Grand Wagoneer?

Ref: a '93 GW...

Mike,

You're going to have to do some research and provide some pretty convincing
evidence...  The plaque at the reno museum, the vin number and one of the
guys that assembled SJ's up till the end all seem to indicate that the
last production year was 91, with ONE 1992 being in existance, written up
in one of the 4x4 magazines, and donated by Chrysler to the museum in reno...
a picture taken by a friend who lives in Reno is on my web page...  Another
friend verified the VIN...  I recall reading about the Hunter Green Wagoneer
long before meeting these other guys...

later,
john

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

> 
> I believe the last year for the Grand Wagoneer was 1993.  It was a Grand 
> Cherokee with fake wood trim on the outside.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> In article <583ase$m2b-at-news.premier1.net>,
>    john-at-virtual-cafe.com (john) wrote:
> >John (doogiezr-at-ix.netcom.com) wrote:
> >: jtw5-at-Lehigh.EDU wrote:
> >
> >: >I was wondering if anyone knows the last model year for the grand 
> Wagoneer.
> >: >Maybe you could include a brief summary of goods and bads about the 
> truck.
> >: >Thanks in advance!!!
> >
> >: >                                                    -James Wilson
> >
> >
> >: The last year for the  Grand was 91, I don't claim to be expert , and
> >: know it all on this model , I can tell you that I built  them for
> >: 8yrs.as a utility (absentee fill in) .and worked on every asspect of
> >: this vehical from the engine line... frame " to trim line and I
> >: love'em and one day I 'm going to go out and buy A well kept version.
> >
> >: P.S. was sad to see'm go... The Grand..."1962 - 1991"
> >
> >: John
> >: Toledo Assembly (reprocess)
> >--------------------------------
> >
> >Turns out there was ONE 1992 made... it's in a museum in Reno, 
> Nevada...
> >
> >John's not the only one that loves these things...  I know of about 70 
> others...
> >
> >There's a bunch of us that are "full-size" jeep nuts that hang out 
> together
> >on our own private list...  one of the guys lives in Reno and sent 
> pictures
> >of it.  Sorry about the color...  better picture is coming...
> >
> >John, if you haven't heard about the Full-Size Jeep List drop me some
> >email, we'd love to hear more from you on your experiences on the line.
> >
> >These are great rigs, too bad they're so thirsty.... :)
> >
> >------
> >
> >John 
> >
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> >        http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john/JEEP/reno.museum.html    
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> >
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ------
> >"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no 
> gun
> > Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on 
> trial
> > They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to 
> hide
> > And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
> >-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ------
> >john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
> 
> ___________________________________________________________________
> Mike Korzeniowski                           Phone: 1-812-378-0281
> President / Software Engineer               email: koski-at-iquest.net
> Software Engineering & Technology, Inc.
> Columbus, IN USA
> 


[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 07:54:32 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Voltage Regulator

> 
> I'm a little confused now.  I thought the voltage regulator in the temp   
> gauge provided 5(?) V to the instrument cluster and the voltage regulator   
> in the alternator would provide 14-15V to run the vehicle and charge the   
> battery.
> 
> Are there alternators that also provide regulated 5V?

NO


> 
> My gauges do odd things occasionally when the engine temp changes quickly   
> so I have been wondering if/how I could put  a real voltage regulator   
> (digital) in to replace the mechanical one in the temp gauge.  Anyone   
> know if/how this can be done?

check your contacts.  clean all electrical contacts.  If you have an older
rig, check for cracks in the circuit board. very common to have cracks and
corrosion.

especially check the mounting studs & nuts that hold the gauges to the board,
they used dissimilar metals, causing corrosion on the electrical contacts..

john

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 07:56:38 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Pinto for an FSJ sir?

I guess the only thing that will top Jeff's story is if somebody
was PAID to take an FSJ...  :)

it COULD happen you know... :)


john

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------


[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 08:01:10 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: what???

maybe we should start a Clueless club...

what's snow?
what's level?
what's electricity?
what's low range?
what's gas mileage?

what moron would skewer a Jeepster body with a fork lift... arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh 

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 17:02:31 +0100
From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Frank_Alm=E5s?=" <falmaas-at-online.no>
Subject: SV: Old Blue's shakes...


> Second question, would it hurt anything to run around in emergency 
> drive with the rear shaft off for a while?
> 
I've done that on several ocations and I never experienced any damage on
the drive line. One time I had to drive with just the front driveshaft
after ripping the rear in two for 560 miles to get home. The Wag
shaked(because of unbalanced front driveshaft) but no damage.

Frank
Norway
 
>  

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 07:59:17 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: lowrange...

> I appreciate the offer...I'm not sure if I'm going to install a low 
> range unit since I don't plan on doing much (if any) off-roading.  I'll 
> get in touch if I become interested, but right now I don't know if the 
> budget has room.  Need too many other things, like brakes...
> Jeff Gunn
> '78 Cherokee

low range is a good thing to have...  even if you don't go wheelin'

doc can tell stories about pulling school buses,
my old man pulled a water tower,
I've yanked 3/4 ton Ford Vans buried to their axles in mud...
I've pulled folks out of ditches during snow...

ALL ON PAVEMENT...  in civilization...

low range is a good thing... :)

john
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------



[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 09:32:45 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: heat/defrost problem?


This may be different from the problems you guys have experience, and 
you may have already tried this, but...

My '78 Cherokee had the heater door stuck half-way open.  The other day, 
I just moved the lever with the cable attached.  That freed up the cable 
and door.  It now opens and closes using the temp control in the cab.  
Is it possible to manually operate some controls to free them up, and 
then your in-cab controls would work?

Just a thought.

Jeff
'78 Cherokee

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 11:33:45 -0500
From: RichHolley-at-aol.com
Subject: Re: gov't surplus...

Greetings all,

In regards to the govt. surplus stuff, most of what my partner acquired is
computers or computer-related items.  This may include mainframes, mainframe
components, massive tape drives, etc...

If you have specific requests, ie full-size plotters, etc, let me know and we
will see if we can find them. 

I would also advise each of you to contact your local military base to see
when their auctions are.  I picked up, for example, a Zenith 14" .28 digital
SVGA monitor for $85.

Being the greedy soul that I am, I cleaned it up and sold it for $125 less
than a week later.......

Anyway, this last auction didn't have any vehicle parts, but I have seen
brand new DIESEL blocks go for $85.........ouch to my taxes, but should make
John drool. :)

So, forward any requests to me, and since my mailbox explodes, make the
subject line something like: RICH YOU IDIOT, READ THIS ONE BEFORE DELETING!!!

That's all for now....

Rich

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 17:30:44 +0100
From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Frank_Alm=E5s?=" <falmaas-at-online.no>
Subject: SV: heat/defrost problem?


> Hi,
> Is it on the 1979 Chief?  My heater is stuck and someone else
> I talked to has the same problem.  I unhooked my cable
> outside under the hood so I could have warmth.  I wish there
> was someone who has fixed the problem to help me!
> I know I need a new cable but there isn't one to be found;
> we have a network of car parts outlets looking!
> 
I had the problem with the cable and I just bought a cable for converting
carbs to manuel choke. Then I just put the inner cable into the original
shield in the Wagoneer. Works OK

Frank
Norway

> My Chief is Orange soon to be white.  I hate the orange they picked!
> The 360 is just with a fresh rebuild.
> 
> Send them my way if you get helped!
> Thanks,
> Greg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> To Unsubscribe send email to macjordomo-at-listserver.tehabi.com with the
command
> "unsubscribe FSJ-List" in the body of the message.
> 
>  

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 17:25:52 +0100
From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Frank_Alm=E5s?=" <falmaas-at-online.no>
Subject: SV: It runs again

Ismo
Thanks, Nice to hear that your Wag runs again.

Frank
Norway
----------
Fra: ik3274-at-bessel.tutech.fi
Til: Multiple recipients of <fsj-list-at-listserver.tehabi.com>
Emne: It runs again
Dato: 09. desember 1996 10:46


	Hi there folks

	Finally I got it fixed. I found the lost spark. There were couple
of wires that had been connected wrong and the ignition module was broken.
I dont know how it did run before because of those wrongly connected
wires. I also replaced one of those famous vacuum lines that was leaking,
and now it runs great. I adjusted the ignition timing, but I think Ill
have to set it a bit later because I have special plugs that give better
spark (in fact three sparks) so they burn the gases more rapidly. It seems
to be a little too much advance, since it gives a little kinda pinging
sound when accelerated in low rpms.

	Hey Frank, you have nice rig. You have its exhaustpipes coming
out from same point as mine, only that I got only one.

well, later

ismo red 77 Cherokee (and soon maybe 73 Wagoneer too)






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[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 09:39:18 -0700
From: trust-at-lanl.gov (Terry Rust)
Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics

>I'm sure you guys have been through this thread a gazillion times before.
>
>I'm fixing to order the Jacobs Ultra pack for my '91 GW.
>The objective is better mileage (now ~12.5 MPG) and maybe better starts in
>the cold.
>Before I spend all that money I'd like some input from the experts:
>
>Good, bad, indifferent ???
>Is there a 'better' alternative?
>
I think Jacobs makes a good product, I installed the Omni Pack on my
daughter's 70 Scout 800 with the IH 304. It seems to have made a positive
impact, but I think that the positives will be more noticeable on the older
model ignition systems. Your 91 might not realize as much a difference.
Give them a call and get their promises and then think it over, I'm
guessing you might see 14 mpg with it, is that enough to warrant the $$?
Would I buy again? yup, I'lds like to put one on my 78 J10 and my 74 CJ and
son's 82 CJ8, not likely in the near term.

Anyway, that's my take on the Jacobs stuff.

Terry  Rust

Pure guesswork has become the basis of a forecast that has been published
in newspapers to be read and understood as a scientific statement."
Endangered Species Blueprint, National Wilderness Institute

"I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important
part in balancing
ecosystems."
John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal







[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 09:52:26 -0700
From: dmatheny-at-mutoh.com
Subject: RE: Re: [fwd: Re: 4 dr. Wide-Traks]


>>dmatheny-at-mutoh.com writes:
>>
>>>I'm a J20 guy. Here are my measurements:
>>>Passenger side backing plate to housing = 16.5"
>>>Driver side backing plate to housing = 22.5"
>>
>>Thanks Dan! It's looking more and more like I could hang a D-60 back   
there
>>with little mods. IF I convert to 8 lugs front and rear, I get 12 1/2"   
disks
>>up front, 12x2.5 drums in back. Not to mention the advantages of a
>>full-floating axle.
>>
>>Can you measure a few more things for me. Like the distance between the
>>spring pads. A good way to do this is from the outside of one pad to   
the >>inside of the other. Of maybe a little easier, from the outside of   
the u-bolt

Distance between spring pads = 50"

>>And measure how wide your spring are. Mine are 2 1/2" and I'm hoping   
your

Spring width = 2.5"

>>If you or anyone else on the list w/ a J-20 finds themselves with both   
rear
>>tires off the rear-end, I would like to have the distance between the   
wheel
>>mounting surfaces (drums pushed on tight).

Distance between wheel mounting surfaces = 67.25"

>>Thanks again,
>>
>>-- Michael Baxter at 74172.1164-at-Compuserve.com

Michael,

Sorry it took so long to get these measurements.  Hope they are of some   
use to you.

Dan

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 12:29:32 EST5EDT4,M4.1.0,M10.5.0
From: snordby-at-topcat.bridgew.edu
Subject: Sunday's trip report

Hi everyone

	Me (Steve in MA) Bill Kaiser 47 Willys, two Cjs and a Scout went to 
Southern NH near VT to tackle the trails.  As some of you might have heard 
they recently recieved 18 inches of snow.  This didn't scare us off.  It made
us want to go more.  We arrived at the trail head at 10:00 am.  The snow was 
deep.  Scott in a 1986 Cj-7 with 35 inch mud terrains decided to take the lead.
He commenced with plowing snow.  He had to go five feet back up in his tracks
and floor it to get another five feet further.  The other five vehicles had 
it easy following his ruts.  The snow weighted down the pine trees and they 
were across the trail.  Scott being lazy decided that he could squeeze around
the trees.  He tried this and one of the trees poped out the side glass in his 
hard top.  We took twine and screwdrivers and put the window back in.  After 
this he got out and shook the snow off the trees to upright them.  We were 
proceeding slowly.  Scott sunk dowm in a mud hole and pushed mud and snow into 
wall that he could not get over.  Out came the winch.  He dragged himself over the Jeep made wall.  Now it was my turn.  I came up to the hole slow then I 
got on the old 6 banger.  I got high centered on the wall.  I could back up 
over the wall, so I would try it again.  I did this five times and said that is
enough give me a pull.  He pulled me over and this flattened the wall down, so 
that the next three vehicles could make it over unassisted.  Just after this 
obstacle I took over the lead.  What fun it was braking the trail.  I was 
pushing a snow pile as high as my hood.  That 6-cylilnder all wheel drive 
tank made through the snow.  It took me two hours to go one mile in the snow.
But I made tho the transmission lines
I crushed these down and stopped for lunch.  After lunch the second Cj took over
the lead.  He didn't last long, because his engine started to wrap.  His 
useless 304 didn't like to work hard.  The Scout then took over the lead.  
While he was working his vehicle his coil wire went, so we gave him one 
of our srapres and off he went.  We finished the trail at 2:00 pm.  We decided
that we didn't have enough daylight left to tackle the next trail.  This was 
the end of a very fun day.  Boy I didn't know that Amc made Jeep WAgoneer snow-
mobiles.  Can't wait to do it all over again.  
Adios
Steve Nordby
1982 WAgoneer (snowmobile)
Plymouth MA 

[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 10:44:54 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics


Just out of curiosity, how much did that Omni Pak set you back ($$$).  

On Dec 9, 10:39am, Terry Rust wrote:
> Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics
> 
> I think Jacobs makes a good product, I installed the Omni Pack on my
> daughter's 70 Scout 800 with the IH 304. It seems to have made a 
positive
> impact, but I think that the positives will be more noticeable on the 
older
> model ignition systems. Your 91 might not realize as much a 
difference.
> Give them a call and get their promises and then think it over, I'm
> guessing you might see 14 mpg with it, is that enough to warrant the 
$$?
> Would I buy again? yup, I'lds like to put one on my 78 J10 and my 74 
CJ and
> son's 82 CJ8, not likely in the near term.
> 
> Anyway, that's my take on the Jacobs stuff.
> 
> Terry  Rust
>  
> 
>-- End of excerpt from Terry Rust


Jeff
"Talks about money too much, must be cheapskate"

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Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 09:57:27 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Sunday's trip report

> the end of a very fun day.  Boy I didn't know that Amc made Jeep WAgoneer snow-
> mobiles.  Can't wait to do it all over again.  
> Adios
> Steve Nordby
> 1982 WAgoneer (snowmobile)

sounds like you had a blast...  I've gotta get my snowmobile ready to go,
shims and brakes, next on the project list...  right after I drop a computer
into the Buick... :)

we'll have to go up into the mountains to find snow... shouldn't be a problem...

john

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Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 13:10:16 -0800
From: kenc-at-softthought.com (Ken Cyr)
Subject: Re: 4.0L for Old Blue ?!

John,

You can look at your XJ for drivetrain measurements.  The YJ
does not have an OD AT and only comes with Command Trac, so
if you want Select Trac and an OD AT, look for an XJ donor.

Cheers,

-Ken

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Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 11:22:25 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: 4.0L for Old Blue ?!

thanx Ken,

I may look at doing the TBI thing first...  If I take good care of
all the pieces, I'm sure somebody on the list won't mind buying the
setup for 3/4 of the purchase price, which should help me back out of
it if a total transplant is the ultimate solution...

otherwise, I may look at getting the guts out of one of those new minivan's
on steroids, aka GC's...  might opt for the 5.2L MPI...  about the same
price as any other option, will just have to wait on an organ donor list... :)

john

> John,
> You can look at your XJ for drivetrain measurements.  The YJ
> does not have an OD AT and only comes with Command Trac, so
> if you want Select Trac and an OD AT, look for an XJ donor.
> Cheers, > > -Ken

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:07:45 -0700
From: trust-at-lanl.gov (Terry Rust)
Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics

>Just out of curiosity, how much did that Omni Pak set you back ($$$).
>

Well, I have this quasi-business so I probably paid more, but it seems that
the Omni Pack with plug wires was in the $250 area, maybe 280 ish. I can
find the invoice tonight or tomorrow if you'ld like. I seem to think that
it wasn't significantly less than some of the mailorder prices, but less
than over the counter.

>On Dec 9, 10:39am, Terry Rust wrote:
>> Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics
>>
>> I think Jacobs makes a good product, I installed the Omni Pack on my
>> daughter's 70 Scout 800 with the IH 304. It seems to have made a
>positive
>> impact, but I think that the positives will be more noticeable on the
>older
>> model ignition systems. Your 91 might not realize as much a
>difference.
>> Give them a call and get their promises and then think it over, I'm
>> guessing you might see 14 mpg with it, is that enough to warrant the
>$$?
>> Would I buy again? yup, I'lds like to put one on my 78 J10 and my 74
>CJ and
>> son's 82 CJ8, not likely in the near term.
>>
>> Anyway, that's my take on the Jacobs stuff.
>>
>> Terry  Rust
>>
>>
>>-- End of excerpt from Terry Rust
>
>
>Jeff
>"Talks about money too much, must be cheapskate"
>
I guess I could be, but I prefer "resource challenged" thank you very much!!

Terry  Rust

Pure guesswork has become the basis of a forecast that has been published
in newspapers to be read and understood as a scientific statement."
Endangered Species Blueprint, National Wilderness Institute

"I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important
part in balancing
ecosystems."
John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal







[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 13:40:02 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics


On Dec 9,  2:07pm, Terry Rust wrote:
> Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics
> 
> >Just out of curiosity, how much did that Omni Pak set you back ($$$).
> >
> 
> Well, I have this quasi-business so I probably paid more, but it seems 
that
> the Omni Pack with plug wires was in the $250 area, maybe 280 ish. I 
can
> find the invoice tonight or tomorrow if you'ld like. I seem to think 
that
> it wasn't significantly less than some of the mailorder prices, but 
less
> than over the counter.
>EXCERPT FROM JEFF GUNN:
> >Jeff
> >"Talks about money too much, must be cheapskate"
> >
> I guess I could be, but I prefer "resource challenged" thank you very 
much!!
> 
> Terry  Rust
> 
> Pure guesswork has become the basis of a forecast that has been 
>  
>-- End of excerpt from Terry Rust

The comment about talking about money too much was aimed at myself 
actually.  I have noticed that money and costs have been mentioned in 
most, if not all, of my posts.  Just trying to stay low-buck and still 
have a decent ride (aren't most of us?)

Jeff
Not trying to offend
'78 Cherokee


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Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 12:19:02 -0800
From: Kara Moloney and Mick Delaney <karaandmick-at-telis.org>
Subject: Re: Wheel Bearing Q's

At 05:40 PM 12/7/96 PST, you wrote:
>

>Alan Bennett
>(sporting a new bearing on 1979 Wagoneer LTD)
>

        hey Alan,
        What was in the LTD version - just curious
        mick


[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 12:19:03 -0800
From: Kara Moloney and Mick Delaney <karaandmick-at-telis.org>
Subject: Re: heat/defrost problem?

At 08:40 AM 12/9/96 -0500, you wrote:
>The easiest thing would be if the main vacuum source was pulled free, its on
>the firewall,  right behind that round resevior ( thing that looks like a
>black ball :)), the line going to the intrument panel is very small , way
>smaller than a normal vac. line... It goes from there to the back of the
> :off.heat.defrost: you have to remove the dash panel to get to that...I went
>through this when it got cold this year...
>

        you may need to drop the steering column a bit to pull put the
instrument panel - i had to on mine (75 wag . There are two vacumn actuators
on either side of the heater dist duct up under the dash. the one on the
left switches between feet/window. the one on the right closes the door in
the firewall to turn off heat.
        If you can't figure out the vac. you can close off the vac source at
the  vac tank on the bulkhead. the vac actuators are held on/off with
springs. popping the springs lets you set the position. I had to do this for
a while until I sorted that mess out.

        have fun
        mick


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Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:14:56 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Wheel Bearing Q's[3~[3~[3~[3~

> 
> At 05:40 PM 12/7/96 PST, you wrote:
> >Alan Bennett
> >(sporting a new bearing on 1979 Wagoneer LTD)
>         hey Alan,
>         What was in the LTD version - just curious
>         mick

mick,
if I may...

LTD = Limited  as opposed to Custom or Brougham... :)
 
john

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------


[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 15:50:27 -0600
From: Matt Kirkwood <kirkwood-at-lsil.com>
Subject: New Guy

Hi All,

I subscribed today and wanted to introduce myself and ask a few
questions.

I currently have a full size Bronco, but my wife and I are seriously
considering buying a full size Jeep wagon to replace our 94 Saturn.  We
saw a really nice 81 Wagoneer this weekend, and that kinda clinched it
for us.  We had been thinking about XJ's, but the SJ(?) body style is
much more stylish (and bigger).

Is there a FSJ-list FAQ somewhere?  The listserver said there wasn't any
info for this list and the home page I found
(http://www.zynet.com/~k_high/fsj/) seems to be down.

Is there some other homepage for the FSJ-list?

The big question I have is what years are the full-size jeeps (I'm sure
this is a FAQ, so please forgive me)?  As I understand it, Cherokees,
and Wagoneers were big until they changed to the XJ style in 84 and the
Grand Wagoneer was around until 91.  Is this correct?

Thanks,
Matt Kirkwood
kirkwood-at-LSIL.com

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 14:53:41 -0700
From: trust-at-lanl.gov (Terry Rust)
Subject: Re: Jacobs Electronics


>
>The comment about talking about money too much was aimed at myself
>actually.  I have noticed that money and costs have been mentioned in
>most, if not all, of my posts.  Just trying to stay low-buck and still
>have a decent ride (aren't most of us?)
>
>Jeff
>Not trying to offend
>'78 Cherokee
>
AMEN!! Brother, with a CJ and a J10, a boy with a Scrambler and a girl with
a Scout 800, I could double my vehicle allowance and still be behind, not
to mention twice as far in the hole. Keep up the fight, "they" say it will
be worth it in the end?



[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:19:22 -0500
From: Gary Sanders <gws-at-n8emr.nitetech.com>
Subject: Jeep wagoneer saga

To followup on my quest for a GW thread last week... 

ITS MINE.... I now have a beige 1986 GW. Ill gets some pix of it on my web
page when I get the digital camera home again...

Overall It looks good, runs good but could use a tune up. Only issue right now
to tackle is a defrost/heater problem. I am hoping I can at least get the
heat flowing a little. Its a bit nippy right now in Ohio. I see a thread
runnning on this topic. Will have to catch up with the group... 

I do want to thank all who replied. Without the group I doubt I would have
purchased the GW. 

More to come.....
Gary W. Sanders gws-at-n8emr.nitetech.com
packet: N8EMR -at- W8CQK Voice: 614-895-2552 (eves/weekends)
"I want to be a nonconformist, just like all my friends"   


[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 14:20:39 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Jeep wagoneer saga

> 
> ITS MINE.... I now have a beige 1986 GW. Ill gets some pix of it on my web
> page when I get the digital camera home again...
> 
> I do want to thank all who replied. Without the group I doubt I would have
> purchased the GW. 

I see, so now it's ok since you have someone to blame>>>  :))))

john

[Back to Top]
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 14:28:48 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: New Guy

Matt,

I've got some info on my web page, and doc has more on the official FSJ page, and
Michael Baxter has some...

start here and have fun:

http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john/JEEP.html

later,
john

oh, btw, zynet is no more... :(


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"When they came for the 2nd Amendment, I said nothing, for I owned no gun
 Then the sixth was next to go, and I remained silent, as I was not on trial
 They took away the fourth, and I said nothing, as I had nothing to hide
 And then they came for the First,  and I could say nothing." 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
john-at-virtual-cafe.com    http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john
       81 (SJ) & 88 (XJ) Jeep Wagoneer Limited     
 Snohomish, WA - where jeeps don't rust, they mold.           
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Real freedom comes from knowing Him who made us free...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------


> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I subscribed today and wanted to introduce myself and ask a few
> questions.
> 
> I currently have a full size Bronco, but my wife and I are seriously
> considering buying a full size Jeep wagon to replace our 94 Saturn.  We
> saw a really nice 81 Wagoneer this weekend, and that kinda clinched it
> for us.  We had been thinking about XJ's, but the SJ(?) body style is
> much more stylish (and bigger).
> 
> Is there a FSJ-list FAQ somewhere?  The listserver said there wasn't any
> info for this list and the home page I found
> (http://www.zynet.com/~k_high/fsj/) seems to be down.

gone

> 
> Is there some other homepage for the FSJ-list?
see above
> 
> The big question I have is what years are the full-size jeeps (I'm sure
> this is a FAQ, so please forgive me)?  As I understand it, Cherokees,
> and Wagoneers were big until they changed to the XJ style in 84 and the
> Grand Wagoneer was around until 91.  Is this correct?

I have info on Jeep codes up on my page as well... 
> 

> Thanks,
> Matt Kirkwood
> kirkwood-at-LSIL.com

[Back to Top]
Date: 9 Dec 1996 15:46:42 -0600
From: "Jeff Gunn" <jgunn-at-hou.varco.com>
Subject: Re: Jeep wagoneer saga


Welcome to the world of FSJ ownership.  I'm new here myself, about 1-1/2 
months.  What part of Ohio are you from?  I'm originally from Ohio, been 
in Texas for 15 years.  
On the heater door, I mentioned it on a previous post, but I manually 
closed mine (it's been warm in Texas) and the inside control now works 
just fine.  Guess I loosened something up in cable or hinge, or 
whatever.  You could at least open it up and get a warm draft!  Whatever 
works, right?

Jeff Gunn
Formerly KA8KOO
Currently N5FYH
'78 Cherokee 4-dr

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Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 15:07:07 -0800 (PST)
From: john <john-at-virtual-cafe.com>
Subject: Re: Jeep wagoneer saga

When I first got Old Blue I had perma-heat...  turns out there were as many
years worth of pine needles in the heater box as there was wagoneer...  but
also the cable wasn't working properly from the dash...

In order to survive even a Pacific Northwest summer, I simply took the cable 
off the arm on the heater box and manually closed the door...

just a thought...

john
> 
> 
> Welcome to the world of FSJ ownership.  I'm new here myself, about 1-1/2 
....
> On the heater door, I mentioned it on a previous post, but I manually 
> closed mine (it's been warm in Texas) and the inside control now works 
> just fine.  Guess I loosened something up in cable or hinge, or 
> whatever.  You could at least open it up and get a warm draft!  Whatever 
> works, right?

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